In Capitalism and Freedom, Milton Friedman warned that heavy government involvement in the economy would reduce our freedom. Friedrich Hayek made a similar argument in The Road to Serfdom.
I have always found this argument to be plausible, but at times I’ve wondered if it is truly persuasive. Throughout my life, European governments have been fairly large as a share of GDP, and yet Europe still seems relatively free, at least compared to some of the more authoritarian parts of the world. Recent events, however, have made me more receptive to the Friedman/Hayek position, particularly the regulation of social media platforms. Here’s David Rose:
If the government directly punished free speech, it would arouse an immediate reaction among voters. Instead, the government works quietly behind the scenes like a mob boss, who effectively says “Nice social media platform you got there. It’d be a shame if something happened to it.”
All the government has to do to debase our right to free speech is to make it more costly than otherwise. The more we have allowed government to enmesh itself into our lives, the greater the risk to us of speaking against the government through actions and inactions that we will likely have no way to prove were motivated by an effort to shape or suppress our speech. . . .
The root of the problem isn’t any given court’s ability to deal wisely with any given misdeed, it is the ability of the government to impose costs without accountability.
People often cite China as an exception to the capitalism promotes freedom hypothesis. But is it? Over the past 40 years:
1. China has regressed in terms of free speech (and speech was far from free back in 1984.)
2. Chinese people are freer to have more than one child.
3. Chinese people are freer to live where they choose. (“Hukou” restrictions remain, but are getting weaker every year.)
4. Chinese people have more freedom to date whomever they choose. (Gays are no longer subject to arrest.)
5. There is far more economic freedom to start businesses, travel, and enter different professions.
I am certainly not arguing that China is a good example of capitalism promoting freedom. It is not. But notice that even in the worst case for Friedman’s hypothesis, the one cited by almost every opponent of neoliberalism, the effect of capitalism on freedom is ambiguous—gains in some areas and losses in others.
READER COMMENTS
Craig
Jul 23 2024 at 11:42pm
“Recent events, however, have made me more receptive to the Friedman/Hayek position, particularly the regulation of social media platforms.”
Indeed, while you are pointing to Europe I might add similar is seen in the US because of government entanglement due to operating relatively large pension funds.
https://www.nationalreview.com/news/desantis-threatens-twitter-with-legal-action-in-elon-musk-dispute/
“During a Tuesday news conference, DeSantis said that the state’s lawyers were reviewing options for legal action against Twitter’s Board of Directors, to “hold them accountable for breaching their fiduciary duty.” Florida, through its Retirement System pension fund, is an investor in Twitter.”
Different tactic employed, but similar could be said of dispute with Disney. A prime example, to borrow a phrase from Pierre, of ‘dirigisme begetting dirigisme’
TMC
Jul 24 2024 at 9:44am
How is that regulating twitter? I doubt the lawsuit will be successful, but it’s clearly a fiduciary matter.
Laurentian
Jul 24 2024 at 12:25am
Are these objective facts which Scott does not believe exist?
I’m, not sure the one-child policy is the best example since it was the creation of Deng rather than Mao.
Scott Sumner
Jul 24 2024 at 12:07pm
If you go all the way back to Mao then the improvement in freedom has been vastly greater than if you merely go back to Deng.
And there are no objective facts, merely perceived facts.
Laurentian
Jul 25 2024 at 2:01am
So the claim that China is more free is merely your own perception?
Scott Sumner
Jul 25 2024 at 1:43pm
I wouldn’t use the term “merely”, but yes. My perceptions are very important—without them I’d know nothing of the world. Every day I perceive thousands of data points, many of which are developed by careful scholars. Why denigrate that process with the term “merely”?
Laurentian
Jul 26 2024 at 5:03am
But that is your own perception and their scholarship is their own perception.
Also Jimmy Lai and Xi Jinping have different perceptions of China then you.
Scott Sumner
Jul 26 2024 at 11:51am
Yes, that’s all true. Welcome to reality!
nobody.really
Jul 24 2024 at 1:32am
I can’t say I’m persuaded by David Rose:
Seriously? The initial colonies/states often had state religions, and imposed sanctions on nonconformists. In Massachusetts, only Christians were allowed to hold public office, and Catholics were allowed to do so only after renouncing papal authority. From 1777 to 1806, New York State’s constitution banned Catholics from public office. In Maryland, Catholics had full civil rights, but Jews did not. Delaware required an oath affirming belief in the Trinity. Prior to 1776 things were even more dicey, with Congregationalist Massachusetts executing Quakers. The Free Exercise Clause of the First Amendment of the US Constitution wouldn’t take effect until 1791—and even then, it would bind only Congress, not the states.
Moreover, the Founders OWNED SLAVES. The idea that they could not imagine people bearing consequences for deviating from an approved message seems a little precious.
The failure to receive discretionary government largesse is now considered a form of oppression?
Obviously, anything that would make speech more costly than it is today debases speech. Oh, wait: By this argument, the entire history of the United States is a history of debased speech—right up until the moment that the US government invented the internet. Does anyone doubt that the Founders would be scandalized by the vast range of speech found on a random person’s cellphone?
What about government action in specific? The general rule is “He who pays the piper calls the tune.” See Rust v. Sullivan (1991) (Upholding rule prohibiting grantee from counseling or making refers related to abortion); Nat. Endowment for the Arts v. Finley (1998) (Upholding statute directing N.E.A. to make grants “taking into consideration general standards of decency….”). You have no duty to play the government’s tune, but you also have no entitlement to the government’s money. That said, SCOTUS has narrowed this general rule: see Perry v. Sindermann (1972) (Public school cannot refuse to renew non-tenured prof’s contract merely because prof criticized school; moreover, prof entitled to hearing in which to demonstrate that school had de facto tenure system—and if successful, entitled to receive school explanation for refusing to renew his contract); Agency for International Development v. Alliance for Open Society International (2013) (A.I.D. exceeded statutory scope and its own discretion when it declared that it would withhold government grants from organizations that refuse to publicly oppose prostitution).
There’s plenty of room to disagree with government policies and SCOTUS’s decisions–but the “deep-state conspiracy” gets old.
Scott Sumner
Jul 24 2024 at 12:05pm
Another example you could cite is Debs being imprisoned for opposing US involvement in WWI.
Andrew_FL
Jul 24 2024 at 9:31am
Apropos of David’s last post, surely China has not “capitalism” but a supremely “mixed economy” at best.
Matthias
Jul 24 2024 at 10:17am
Yes, but they have more capitalism than they used to have under Mao.
Capitalism is supposed to work gradually, too. A bit more of capitalism gives you a bit more of its benefits.
There’s no hiding behind ‘real capitalism has never been tried’ for us.
Andrew_FL
Jul 24 2024 at 1:28pm
Actually I think degree of being relatively capitalist or not is highly relevant. It’s not the same as dismissing any failed case of socialism as “unreal”. Degree to which a country is capitalist seems to correlate with the degree to which it is free politically.
TMC
Jul 24 2024 at 9:43am
Sometimes the regulation is more direct. Recently there was a case where a Swedish girl was gang raped. They had DNA evidence on 7 men, but only one went to jail. The biggest loser was another girl who got an even longer sentence for complaining about it on social media. Anti-migrant speech laws.
David Seltzer
Jul 24 2024 at 11:52am
Scott: To support Rose’s comment, the CCP dismantled democracy in Hong Kong, one of the freest economies in the world. Free speech was and is still stilted with national security laws and threats of incarceration for political dissent. I spent considerable time in HK during the 1960’s. Little interference from Brit officials, little or no social services which allowed individuals to rely on themselves and their families. The major advantage was and is the port.
Scott Sumner
Jul 24 2024 at 12:03pm
Hong Kong never had much democracy. But the CCP did take away freedom of expression.
David Seltzer
Jul 24 2024 at 12:20pm
Scott; Thanks for you comment. I recall hearing Friedman speak when I was a grad student at Chicago. He seemed to regard Hong Kong as a free-market ideal. He liked the idea of it’s risk assuming capitalism, the entrepreneurial spirit of its citizens, British deference to free-market, common-law principles, and tight-fisted social policies. It seems individual freedom, such as it was, was fostered by free markets in action. Of course I could be wrong.
David Seltzer
Jul 24 2024 at 2:38pm
Scott: Apologies. I didn’t acknowledge your comment about HK never being a democracy. You’re right. It wasn’t an electoral democracy.
Dan Smith
Jul 25 2024 at 11:40am
Scott: Great post highlighting this important hypothesis.
Hayek’s argument, however, is more nuanced. While Friedman’s argument was between economic freedom and political freedom (tested by Lawson and Clark: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0167268110000430), Hayek’s argument was capitalism, as defined as private ownership of the means of production and political freedom (tested by Benzecry, Reinarts, and myself and now forthcoming in Public Choice: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4318664).With coauthors, I’m also doing a deep dive into the history of economic thought of Hayek’s Road to Serfdom (https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4892215#). For instance, one of the interesting findings is that the socialists Hayek was engaging also expressed a deep concern about the relationship between socialism and tyranny (https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4767976).
Best, Dan Smith (MTSU)
Jim Glass
Jul 26 2024 at 2:15am
Even making the heroic assertion (beyond all reason) that the effect of capitalism on freedom is always positive, every day in every way for everybody, how could the observed effect in a real society be anything but ambiguous to a lesser or greater degree?
Confounding variables. (Like the CCP.)
Jim Glass
Jul 26 2024 at 3:11am
Ha! Like the cost of spewing ideas across the world via social media is *so high* today compared to all history! All the ‘rationally ignorant’ of the entire world now for the first time can be reached directly by everyone for free! Thus the flood tide of scammers on every subject: investments, health, romance, politics … Joe Rogan just got himself $250 million by bringing to the rationally ignorant masses the leading proponents of Space Aliens among us, Ancient World-Wide Civilizations unknown to archeologists, Vaccinations Causing Autism (proponents profiting correspondingly) … and Joe’s at the exceedingly reasonable and respectable end. But wait, there’s more!…
Wikipedia’s founder and head, Jimmy Wales, was accused of being a child molester, anonymously and repeatedly, online. He has direct access to the heads of Twitter, etc., and asked that the posts be taken down. They told him “Nope, free speech!”. (He eventually got some taken down for ‘spamming’, there were so many. Not for the horrendous libel.) If a Lord of New Media like him can’t protect himself from horrible anonymous slurs, think of all the high school kids, and everyone else.
The forms or free speech known as willful lying, fraud, slander and libel, used to come with extra costs attached ranging from lawsuits for fraud, libel and misrepresentation, to shame-and-embarrassment when caught and exposed. But no more! Especially all these worst kinds of free speech are today much freer than ever.
Maybe these kinds of free speech should be more costly — like they always were. Which gets us to politics, which is crammed to the gills with all the worst kinds of online free speech — and I suspect to Mr. Rose’s real point.
How to rightfully increase the cost of toxic, deceitful, lying, idiotic political free speech? Use your own free speech to objectively point out the absurd falsities in it. But there is blow-back for this. Take the Right-political side. Righties who actually believed the lie that “public figures who posed being vaccinated actually faked it with retractable needles”, and much worse, don’t like being exposed as idiots by media researchers. And the politicians who collected their votes like it even less. How to strike back?
Well, researchers are affiliated with universities … and universities get government money … and “the government works quietly behind the scenes like a mob boss”. Ergo, the researcher are soldiers of the mob sent to murder free speech using government power. Using this logic, Mr Rose’s allies are bringing lawsuits alleging illegal censorship and suppression of wonton idiocies. E.g.: Gateway Pundit is suing Stanford, University of Washington and others to stop “the largest mass surveillance and mass censorship program in American history”. Cough. (Watch out, Prof Sumner, criticize someone who says Covid was a weaponized virus funded with money from the USA sent by Fauci, and you may get added as a defendant.)
Of course, the researchers don’t censor or suppress anything. They just report what is said. But the most ardent defenders of free speech know nothing says “I support free speech!” like suing to silence those who report what you say.
BTW, an interesting chart of 170 years of American sentiment. (via Tyler)
“We really are living in an era of negativity-poisoned discourse that is (*empirically*) historically unique.”
Robert Seber
Jul 26 2024 at 8:09am
Don’t forget the effect of taxation. As government grows, so do taxes. At an effective tax rate of over 50%, I work half of the year solely for the government. That is serfdom.
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